tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post6587039900702792326..comments2016-06-09T13:34:26.255-04:00Comments on The Daily Lipid: My Discussion With Vegan Physician Dr. Michael Greger on Stand Up! Now Free With No Registration Hassle!Chris Masterjohnhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09922003080748568167noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-25744927154986984162015-01-21T20:58:21.623-05:002015-01-21T20:58:21.623-05:00I eat a low fat fruit and veggie diet. So if anyt...I eat a low fat fruit and veggie diet. So if anything, I do NOT agree with Robert Atkins, but the diet wasn&#39;t funded solely funded by him. Dude, when you are dishonest or a cherry picker with intellectual nonsense, you set all us vegetarians/vegans back.<br /><br /> Sources of Funding<br /><br />The study was funded by the following sources: (1) Israeli Ministry of Health, Chief Scientist Office (grants received by Drs Shai, Schwarzfuchs, and Tirosh, Israel); (2) Canadian Institutes of Health Research (MOP6655) and Heart and Stroke Foundation of Canada (Ontario; NA5912; grants received by Drs <br />Fenster, Parraga, and Spence, Canada); (3) Disabled Facilities grant (KFO 152; grants received by Drs Bl├╝her and Stumvoll, Germany); and (4) the Dr Robert C. and Veronica Atkins Research Foundation. This foundation was not involved in any stage of the design, conduct, or analysis of the study and had no access to the study results before publication. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-22154300087027989422014-04-02T02:29:32.979-04:002014-04-02T02:29:32.979-04:00Funded by the Atkins foundation, of course... try ...Funded by the Atkins foundation, of course... try again. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-14947998023521170582014-03-30T20:22:41.088-04:002014-03-30T20:22:41.088-04:00Hello Chris, Flying pigs not withstanding, can yo...Hello Chris,<br /><br />Flying pigs not withstanding, can you comment on the next best thing? That is to say - the group in the-esseltyn-diet-study serving as their own control. The statistic quoted of almost 50 cardiac events prior to intervention followed by zero afterwards sounded pretty compelling in my part of the room. <br /><br /><br />justin<br /><br />ps as always, thanks for keeping it civil.Justinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-66768445894234662352014-03-23T01:12:24.980-04:002014-03-23T01:12:24.980-04:00I think that to be honest, you were doomed from th...I think that to be honest, you were doomed from the very start by entering with your debates with the vegan community. <br /><br />1. You are going to a debate run by vegans with a vegan audience - not necessarily a neutral audience. That&#39;s a very big uphill battle right there. <br /><br />2. The limited experience you have debating. Debating is, from experience, a skill that takes time to cultivate. It is not just what you say or whether your facts are correct, it is a matter of how you articulate it. This favors the stronger communicator, not necessarily the person who is factually accurate. <br /><br />3. Format limitations of debating. There isn&#39;t the time to take things point by point and prove or disprove what is being said. Logical fallacies, arguments that are superficially appealing but lack real solid facts, and so on are very effective debate tactics, even though they may not be factually accurate. <br /><br />4. It is also a battle of willpower. The person who shows the most charisma, even to the point of fanaticism, often commands the advantage. Also typical presentation skills like tone, body language, etc are very decisive. <br /><br />It is like politics. The person that gets their facts right may not always win - in fact it is often a disadvantage because you are fumbling to point out the other person&#39;s flaws in their arguments and struggle to mount a consistent counter message. <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />From experience, I did spend a considerable amount of my time debating a creationist community. When you debate with people who are just that close minded, not much is going to happen no matter what facts or information you bring. <br /><br />I think that there are some interesting parallels between the creationist community and the vegan community. It may very well be that for a substantial number of vegans, unless they experience declining health first-hand, they will never understand. Chrishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01014823246265859953noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-30435131529080232582014-03-14T10:06:08.007-04:002014-03-14T10:06:08.007-04:00Chris, pigs flying? What about this study that sho...Chris, pigs flying? What about this study that shows reversal of atherosclerosis on Atkins... http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/121/10/1200.longmikekinnaird2001http://happyguide.co/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-31175564854428877742014-03-02T19:26:32.918-05:002014-03-02T19:26:32.918-05:00Very interesting commentary. Thank you for sharing...Very interesting commentary. Thank you for sharing, I dont agree with all your points but you make a few sound pointsDanhttp://theproactolreview.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-16966213967698511482014-02-24T21:10:29.322-05:002014-02-24T21:10:29.322-05:00I agree with the other commentators - nice job Chr...I agree with the other commentators - nice job Chris!Robhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13314984696445429209noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-65781881007292798122014-02-24T17:34:26.443-05:002014-02-24T17:34:26.443-05:00I just listened to it, and you were by far more ar...I just listened to it, and you were by far more articulate and better spoken than Dr. Gregor. Of course I&#39;m biased, but the fact that I&#39;m now somewhat interested in this Esseltyn study shows the value of this kind of discussion. What a difference from the last &quot;debate&quot; - really, you&#39;re brilliant.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5977689274110133568.post-39412084558729467652014-02-24T16:56:25.943-05:002014-02-24T16:56:25.943-05:0032:39 &#39;But I agree with you. If Esselstyn can ...32:39<br />&#39;But I agree with you. If Esselstyn can show this diet causes pigs to fly, I will not ask you for a control group.&#39;<br /><br />A cutting way to reveal the absurdity of his bias.<br /><br />Your speaking skills have improved even since the intelligence squared debate. I always look forward to such interchanges, and I&#39;m rarely disappointed.Jasonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01402480433126726233noreply@blogger.com